aggressive does NOT equal predatory
- Thread starter Managuense
- Start date
Hey Managuense, at least you admitt to simply playing devils advocate and wanting a semantics debate.
Predation does not necessarily equal aggression, nor the other way around.
I have seen aggressive neons before. Neons that like to nip on the fins of fish such as a betta could be said to be preforming an aggressive act towards the betta. On the other hand, a betta that is flaring at a rival is considered aggressive towards that rival. Aggression is a behavioral assessment that usually is interpreted as hostility of one individual towards another. This could be over mates, territory, heirarchy, etc.
The term carnivorous has two meanings. One is as a taxonmic Order of the Phylum Mammalia. Taxonmically, dogs, cats, bears, hyena, etc are all Carnivora in that they have fully developed canine teeth for ripping and shearing. If you've ever looked at the canine teeth of humans, ours are not developed quite so well for ripping and shearing, which is why we are not members of the Carnivora Order.
The other defination of carnivore is dietary. Dogs are dietarily omnivores, in that their diet must compose of a certain percentage of roughage and grains for them to stay healthy, but the primary bulk of it is meats. Cats, on the other hand, are obligate carnivores, which means their diets must consist solely of meat in order for them to get full nutrition. Cats should never, ever, ever be placed on a vegan diet as it will spell out their death!! Dogs can handle a certan degree of veganism with the right nutritional subliments.
Predation is a mode of obtaining food, and is generally accepted as referring to the act of stalking or ambushing the food source. Cats are predators, they stalk their food and chase it down to obtain it. A Gar is a predator in that it waits in hiding, then ambushes its food. You do not have to be carnivorous in order to be a predator, yet it is generally accepted that all carnivores are predators. Omnivorous dogs are predators in that they will chase down a food source.
Is the neon a predator, semantic wise yes it is, in that it will chase down and consume brine shrimp. Classification-wise, it is a plankton grazer. It is widely accepted that micro-organisms do not count as a carnivorous diet, and are just given their own classification in the lump term plankton. Plankton grazers are not usually called carnivores or predators. The great manta ray is not considered a carnivore or a predator, but a plankton grazer, even though plankton consists largely of microscopic "flesh" so to speak. Blue whales are omnivorous grazers, even though they eat krill and small shoals of fish, they will ingest algae incidentally. Orca are carnivorous predators, they actively hunt and subsist exclusively on flesh, ie seal, other whales, and salmon.
Is predation an aggressive behavior? Yes it is. A predator acts aggressively towards its prey in the effort to subdue it. An individual acts aggressively towards a rival in defending territory.
Some predators may not be territorialy aggressive, and some fish that are not predators (I belive Mbuna were given as an example) behave with territory aggression.
Fish like gars, that are not territorially aggressive towards other species, I simply call "peaceful predators." Yes they eat other fish and meat, but they're not like Mbunas that attack any and all tankmates. Clown knives fall into that "peaceful predator" catagory, as do arowana and african butterflies. Yes, with the proper planning and tank size, certain predators will be happy to room with certain other species of fish that they can't swallow or intimidate. But most lay-people and non-fish astute individuals will take a gar, then try to have a tank of neons with it. That's why it is best to lable predators under the aggressive catagory, so the stupid people out there don't do stupid things, then blame the rest of us educated folk for not telling them that the fish was "aggressive" when they bought it.
~~Colesea
Predation does not necessarily equal aggression, nor the other way around.
I have seen aggressive neons before. Neons that like to nip on the fins of fish such as a betta could be said to be preforming an aggressive act towards the betta. On the other hand, a betta that is flaring at a rival is considered aggressive towards that rival. Aggression is a behavioral assessment that usually is interpreted as hostility of one individual towards another. This could be over mates, territory, heirarchy, etc.
The term carnivorous has two meanings. One is as a taxonmic Order of the Phylum Mammalia. Taxonmically, dogs, cats, bears, hyena, etc are all Carnivora in that they have fully developed canine teeth for ripping and shearing. If you've ever looked at the canine teeth of humans, ours are not developed quite so well for ripping and shearing, which is why we are not members of the Carnivora Order.
The other defination of carnivore is dietary. Dogs are dietarily omnivores, in that their diet must compose of a certain percentage of roughage and grains for them to stay healthy, but the primary bulk of it is meats. Cats, on the other hand, are obligate carnivores, which means their diets must consist solely of meat in order for them to get full nutrition. Cats should never, ever, ever be placed on a vegan diet as it will spell out their death!! Dogs can handle a certan degree of veganism with the right nutritional subliments.
Predation is a mode of obtaining food, and is generally accepted as referring to the act of stalking or ambushing the food source. Cats are predators, they stalk their food and chase it down to obtain it. A Gar is a predator in that it waits in hiding, then ambushes its food. You do not have to be carnivorous in order to be a predator, yet it is generally accepted that all carnivores are predators. Omnivorous dogs are predators in that they will chase down a food source.
Is the neon a predator, semantic wise yes it is, in that it will chase down and consume brine shrimp. Classification-wise, it is a plankton grazer. It is widely accepted that micro-organisms do not count as a carnivorous diet, and are just given their own classification in the lump term plankton. Plankton grazers are not usually called carnivores or predators. The great manta ray is not considered a carnivore or a predator, but a plankton grazer, even though plankton consists largely of microscopic "flesh" so to speak. Blue whales are omnivorous grazers, even though they eat krill and small shoals of fish, they will ingest algae incidentally. Orca are carnivorous predators, they actively hunt and subsist exclusively on flesh, ie seal, other whales, and salmon.
Is predation an aggressive behavior? Yes it is. A predator acts aggressively towards its prey in the effort to subdue it. An individual acts aggressively towards a rival in defending territory.
Some predators may not be territorialy aggressive, and some fish that are not predators (I belive Mbuna were given as an example) behave with territory aggression.
Fish like gars, that are not territorially aggressive towards other species, I simply call "peaceful predators." Yes they eat other fish and meat, but they're not like Mbunas that attack any and all tankmates. Clown knives fall into that "peaceful predator" catagory, as do arowana and african butterflies. Yes, with the proper planning and tank size, certain predators will be happy to room with certain other species of fish that they can't swallow or intimidate. But most lay-people and non-fish astute individuals will take a gar, then try to have a tank of neons with it. That's why it is best to lable predators under the aggressive catagory, so the stupid people out there don't do stupid things, then blame the rest of us educated folk for not telling them that the fish was "aggressive" when they bought it.
~~Colesea
Yeah it is. TFH owns all. I have 13 issues of them.
But do you get them free? It's awesome. Have you ever seen the issues with the "Free tank warming gift" logo on it? They sit inside of some All-Glass Aquarium tanks at fish stores. Since I work at one, I get to snag all the mags I want. It's pretty sweet.
Which issue is that shark article found? I'm not familiar with it.
But do you get them free? It's awesome. Have you ever seen the issues with the "Free tank warming gift" logo on it? They sit inside of some All-Glass Aquarium tanks at fish stores. Since I work at one, I get to snag all the mags I want. It's pretty sweet.
Which issue is that shark article found? I'm not familiar with it.
Speaking of TFH....did you guys happen to see the recient article on piranhas? Brian Scott is the author of the article and an editor at TFH. He is a member and community sponsor at Piranha-fury.com. Most of his posts are in the piranha science section. He is also amazingly knowledgable about cichlids.