Fish Suggestions for a beginner tank

[Disco]

I'm looking at starting up a 40 gallon breeder saltwater tank. I allready have a 36 inch compact flourecsent fixture. I want to have some smaller beginner-freindly corals and anenomes, as well as a few peices of live rock. What is involved and what reef safe, invertabrate safe fish can I have? I really like firefish and pygmy angels along with damsels. Also, how soon can I add live rock to a tank after initial filling? Please tell me anything that's involved including what supplements I have to add and what qualities to check and also how long should I cycle and how often should I change my water?
                   Thanks,
                       Disco

[Disco]

Sorry about the picture, I'm an iddiot ;D

[Disco]

I EVEN SPELLED "IDIOT" WRONG- AHHHHHH!!!

[catfish]

Hey Disco, congrats on taking the salt plunge.  I waited a few years for fear of the extra work and cost.  I have started out with a simple salt tank, some live rock and a few fish.  From my experience, and that of a lfs owner friend, you can add live rock right away, should actually help with the initial tank.  I was told to wait several months (3-6) to add anemomes, as they need a well established tank to thrive.  One note about Damsels, they are great to cycle a tank with because they are hardy and cheap, but they can get a bit nippy to other fish, so far mine haven't.  I don't add any supplements, but I only have some live rock, a sailfin tang, picasso trigger, maroon clown, snowflake eel and 2 damsels in a 55 gal.  I cycled for 6 weeks before adding anything else and change my water monthly, I'm sure I will be told not often enough.  Good luck, hope this is helpful

[Disco]

I changed my idea of the fish I want. How about some royal grammas, firefish, flame angel, and a mandarin goby? Any other nice things to add and are all these reef safe?

[catfish]

I don't have any experience with reef tanks,  I have just a simple salt setup, from what I have heard, reef tanks are a lot of extra work that I just don't want to bother with.  I believe the water conditions for a reef tank are a bit more tricky.  

The flame angel is a nice fish, I don't know about the grammas or the firefish.  I believe the mandarin goby is not recommended for beginners and that they can be tough to keep.  A nice alternative might be the scooter blenny or the scissortail goby.

[Disco]

Yeah, I guess I'll do it fish only. If I do it fish only, do I still need supplements? What types of rock do I use? Can I still get those different colored algae in a fish only tank? What about 1 flame angel, 1 Longnose Hawkfish, 3 Scooter Blennies, and 1 Atlantic Pygmy Angel? Any thing I should change? For lighting since I have two 65 watt compact flourescents, can I still get good algae growth for any vegetarians?

[Ovrclckd]

Okay... where to start:

Disco. No such thing as a "beginner friendly coral" or anemome. Mushrooms or polyps are about the only things you can keep with that light, maybe softies as well. They will still probably die, corals aren't the easiest thing to keep.

Anemones are bad news period. An established tank does not mean you can keep an anemone. They need serious lighting (5-7w per gallon is a good starting point).

Rock goes in immediately. Use only live rock, the best you can get. Look for pieces that are light for their size, meaning full of holes. That way you get more interesting pieces, and it will cost less to fill your tank. The "pretty algae" your talking about is coraline algae, it does not need a reef tank to grow. It does need calcium to be dosed, along with a buffer. Most people use something called kalkwasser, which is calcium carbonate (i think...) which dissolves in water. For coraline algea to grow, fair lighting is necessary, along with calcium level of 400 - 450 ppm, and a kh of 7 - 8.

Stocking. Atlantic and flame angel will fight in a tank your size. Scooter blennies can be kept together. Hawkfish love to eat shrimp, and will eat crabs and other small inverts as well. The firefish was a good idea. Same with the gramma.

Catfish, return the sailfin tang to the store. Its not happy, and never will be. I don't know if you read enough about it, but they get upto 16" in diameter, and are very active swimmers. Any four foot tank is too small, and a 55 is way, way not wide enough (front to back). Minimum tank size for a juvenile (probably what you have) would be a 125, the smallest 6 foot tank, for swimming room alone. Adults require a 180 or larger.

[catfish]

Disco,  OwnedbyKitten seems to have much more experience, so listen to him

OwnedbyKitten, the Sailfin is only 3-4 inches long and seems to be doing fine with the room he has to swim in as the tank is not overly crowded with decorations.  My plan is to get a much larger tank for them in the future, so no need to worry there,thanks for the advise.

[Ovrclckd]

[quote author=catfish link=board=saltwater&num=996459861&start=0 #8 date=08/01/01 at 09:09:15]
Disco, *OwnedbyKitten seems to have much more experience, so listen to him

OwnedbyKitten, the Sailfin is only 3-4 inches long and seems to be doing fine with the room he has to swim in as the tank is not overly crowded with decorations. *My plan is to get a much larger tank for them in the future, so no need to worry there,thanks for the advise.
[/quote]

A guy came in to our store, he had a a 4" die in a 40 long (smallest 4' tank there is tho), water was perfect, aggression was minimal. The tank size was just plain too small, and it died from stress related causes. So its just a warning.