Domination of ICK

lludu · 11-12-2009, 03:49 PM

So had one fish develop ick, tried to treat it using Jungle Ick Clear Tank Buddies tablets, which apparently i have had no success with. Over the past 3 days, ick has claimed almost all of my fish population, and the remaining ones, cept for my oto cats have ick on them. I'm still treating the tank for it with the tablets, but i'm assuming that it probably will not work and i'll have some more dead ones tomorrow or soon.

So my question is, assuming the parasite kills my entire community, how do i kill off the thing permanently (yes i know its always in the tank, but you get what i mean) and start over. *assuming the cats live through it (they look healthy) i'll move them into my 10gallon for now.

Do i raise the temp. to the highest it can be and wait for a week or two? New rocks? New artificial plants? New rootwood? i'd hate to replace everything but i will do it if necessary.

Newman · 11-12-2009, 05:05 PM

Hmmm, well i havent ever been hit that badly like you described. ive had my goldfish develop ich about two weeks ago cuz the water was around 80F, and perhaps that was stressin it out, or the ich was carried by some other fish i bought, that i didnt see...whatever the case, i just lowered the temp to 75F and fed it a varied diet, and in about 4 days the ich was improving, and in 7 days it was completely gone. i havent seen it since it finished its life cycle on the goldfish, and havent had a problem w/ it since.

From what you described...it sounds serial enough to clear the fish to another tank (unaffected) and raise the temp, add salt w/e. try not to ovemedicate. mait a few weeks, then add a fish a few at a time. I find ich mostly attacks when i fish is stressed (it has just been through a rough trimp from a petstore, or it wasnt acclimated properly and went into shock, got covered with ich) there are a lot of causes i suspect. maybe a little more research would help. I usually just dont medicate and the ich clears on its own (my past pleco had the same story as my goldfish did. no he didnt die i just gave him away.) I'm just stating that fish can sometimes overcome ich.

Maybe some water changes might help? bad water quality might also trigger these parasites as the fishes immune system is weakened with any sort of long-term stress.

lludu · 11-12-2009, 06:40 PM

well im going to see how it does tomorrow, and move the otos to the 10 gallon tank. if the other fish still have trouble with ick and end up dying, what should i do with the plants / wood?

how do i go about fully getting the tank back to normal?

OrangeCones · 11-13-2009, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lludu

well im going to see how it does tomorrow, and move the otos to the 10 gallon tank. if the other fish still have trouble with ick and end up dying, what should i do with the plants / wood?

how do i go about fully getting the tank back to normal?

How long has this ick-filled tank been set up? What are your reading for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate?

lludu · 11-13-2009, 11:19 AM

rest of the fish did end up dying, i moved the otos to their own 10 gallon tank, did a complete water change on the 20gallon, boiled plants and wood and vacuumed rocks, and currently have the new water blasted to 87 degrees, no filter right now, although i did clean the filter out and put a new cartridge in, anything else i should do?

Newman · 11-13-2009, 12:24 PM

make sure the water is treated, and run that filter. add a few ammonia drops into the water and test + add untuil you reach 5 ppm. then leave it and basically do what you did for the cycle. If you still have bacteria in your filter media then this will only be a mini cycle, but can take up to 2 weeks so make sure youre cheinking the water and adding ammonia when your ammonia starts to read close to 0 or 0.

Nemo'sMom · 11-14-2009, 09:42 AM

Is it possible to have an ich-free tank? I don't know that much about it. someone told me that when quarantining fish from the store that ich has the longest life-cycle -about 4 wks. So I waited 4 weeks before adding each of my fish to the big tank. I never saw ich on any of them from the time i bought them to when I placed them in the bigger tank. Is it possible to then have an ich-free tank? or is it still in there, lying in wait, to rear it's ugly head? Just curious ...

Newman · 11-14-2009, 02:39 PM

I dont know, its a curious question.
From the way ive experienced, yes it is APPEARS to be possible.
Ich often appears when you place new fish in or when you overstock. the new fish that may display ich upon their first few days in your tank will contaminate your other fish and thats probably how a breakout occurs. also the overstocking question (that i was asking myself):

1. overtocking can obviously happen when you instroduce more new fish. now those could be infected and contaminate your ich-free fish.

2. overstocking can also be a result of new fry overpopulating the tank. so say your stock is all healthy and your fish havent seen ich for say 3 years until they decided to breed. then you got about 30 fry growin up and at a certain point they actually overstock the tank. and BAM you start seeing ich appear

where the heck did that come from?! you didnt introduce any fish or plants or anything new, so how did ich just spawn in there on all your fish?

I obviously have no answer to the second scenario, so what you've asked is actually an interesting question. maybe someone who has tested this kinda stuff can chime in and explain it :[ ? cant seem to answer the #2 since i havent tested it out yet, so i cant really 100% say that a tank can be ich free.

Theoretically if you dont overstock, feed you fish right and the correct amount, if you keep a brackish or marine tank, and your temp is in the fishes' desired range then you shouldt ever see ich appear. unless you obviously add new fish...

Nemo'sMom · 11-14-2009, 05:55 PM

I found this site that seems to explain Ich in a pretty straightforward manner. I thought about copying the info here, but there's a lot of it. Thought about paraphrasing, but there is still too much information :-) I would recommend reading it to anyone who wants to know more about Ich.

They do talk about the life-cycle and when to treat and how to clean a tank that is infected. Should answer most/all of your questions.

Cause, Treatment, and Prevention of Ich in Freshwater Fish

Newman · 11-14-2009, 06:20 PM

that is an awsome and very infromative site, thanks!
I think it basically is the longer version of my post, especially the last thing i said there. except i would have to change the YES to a NO. and the brackish and marine tank is just a little bit on how salty water improves immunity (in some cases).
BUT
this source doesnt exactly say how ich can just "randomly" break out in a healthy tank, when youve added no new plants or fish or anything. what the site says is what i said before: that fluctuations in temp, ammonia present, basically anything that causes stress and weakening of the immune system will cause an outbreak of ich. so...where did that ich comefrom if the tank is "ich free"? It seems like the site is saying that a tank can never be ich-free. its just that, it seems that way, when our fish are at their best and their immune systems are too strong for ich to take over and manifest as the visible white dots.

So looks like the aquarium cant ever be ich free eh?
Soooo if you drastically lowered the temp in a tropical tank or raised the temp in a goldfish tank, then ich would strike like the little parasitic ninja that it is....

11-12-2009, 03:49 PM	#1
lludu Little Fish Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Millersville, PA Posts: 114	Domination of ICK So had one fish develop ick, tried to treat it using Jungle Ick Clear Tank Buddies tablets, which apparently i have had no success with. Over the past 3 days, ick has claimed almost all of my fish population, and the remaining ones, cept for my oto cats have ick on them. I'm still treating the tank for it with the tablets, but i'm assuming that it probably will not work and i'll have some more dead ones tomorrow or soon. So my question is, assuming the parasite kills my entire community, how do i kill off the thing permanently (yes i know its always in the tank, but you get what i mean) and start over. assuming the cats live through it (they look healthy) i'll move them into my 10gallon for now. Do i raise the temp. to the highest it can be and wait for a week or two? New rocks? New artificial plants? New rootwood? i'd hate to replace everything but i will do it if necessary. __________________ 35g;* 5 Black Kuhli Loaches, 1 Striped Kuhli Loach, 2 German Blue Ram, 6 Red Cherry Shrimp, 2 Ghost Shrimp, 2 Otocinclus Catfish, 1 Bamboo Shrimp, 2 Gold Apple Snails, 1 Black Apple Snail, 1 Assassin Snail, 4 Anachris, 2 Hornwort, 4 Mint Charlies, 3 Umbrella Plants, 1 Flame Moss, 1 Large Marimo Ball 20g, 10g, 1.5g; Empty

11-12-2009, 06:40 PM	#3
lludu Little Fish Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Millersville, PA Posts: 114	well im going to see how it does tomorrow, and move the otos to the 10 gallon tank. if the other fish still have trouble with ick and end up dying, what should i do with the plants / wood? how do i go about fully getting the tank back to normal? __________________ 35g; 5 Black Kuhli Loaches, 1 Striped Kuhli Loach, 2 German Blue Ram, 6 Red Cherry Shrimp, 2 Ghost Shrimp, 2 Otocinclus Catfish, 1 Bamboo Shrimp, 2 Gold Apple Snails, 1 Black Apple Snail, 1 Assassin Snail, 4 Anachris, 2 Hornwort, 4 Mint Charlies, 3 Umbrella Plants, 1 Flame Moss, 1 Large Marimo Ball 20g, 10g, 1.5g; Empty

11-13-2009, 11:19 AM	#5
lludu Little Fish Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Millersville, PA Posts: 114	rest of the fish did end up dying, i moved the otos to their own 10 gallon tank, did a complete water change on the 20gallon, boiled plants and wood and vacuumed rocks, and currently have the new water blasted to 87 degrees, no filter right now, although i did clean the filter out and put a new cartridge in, anything else i should do? __________________ 35g; 5 Black Kuhli Loaches, 1 Striped Kuhli Loach, 2 German Blue Ram, 6 Red Cherry Shrimp, 2 Ghost Shrimp, 2 Otocinclus Catfish, 1 Bamboo Shrimp, 2 Gold Apple Snails, 1 Black Apple Snail, 1 Assassin Snail, 4 Anachris, 2 Hornwort, 4 Mint Charlies, 3 Umbrella Plants, 1 Flame Moss, 1 Large Marimo Ball 20g, 10g, 1.5g; Empty

11-13-2009, 12:24 PM	#6
Newman Super Fish Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Northern NJ Posts: 2,779	make sure the water is treated, and run that filter. add a few ammonia drops into the water and test + add untuil you reach 5 ppm. then leave it and basically do what you did for the cycle. If you still have bacteria in your filter media then this will only be a mini cycle, but can take up to 2 weeks so make sure youre cheinking the water and adding ammonia when your ammonia starts to read close to 0 or 0. __________________ Credit goes to Lludu

11-14-2009, 09:42 AM	#7
Nemo'sMom Teenie Weenie Fish Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 36	Is it possible to have an ich-free tank? I don't know that much about it. someone told me that when quarantining fish from the store that ich has the longest life-cycle -about 4 wks. So I waited 4 weeks before adding each of my fish to the big tank. I never saw ich on any of them from the time i bought them to when I placed them in the bigger tank. Is it possible to then have an ich-free tank? or is it still in there, lying in wait, to rear it's ugly head? Just curious ... __________________ 26 gallon: 1 Red Oranda (I have a 2 yo... of course his name is Nemo) 1 Calico Ryukin (Nigel ... again "Finding Nemo") 1 Red/White Ryukin (Coral ... you get the picture) 3 gallon: shrimp someday?

11-12-2009, 05:05 PM	#2
Newman Super Fish Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Northern NJ Posts: 2,779	Hmmm, well i havent ever been hit that badly like you described. ive had my goldfish develop ich about two weeks ago cuz the water was around 80F, and perhaps that was stressin it out, or the ich was carried by some other fish i bought, that i didnt see...whatever the case, i just lowered the temp to 75F and fed it a varied diet, and in about 4 days the ich was improving, and in 7 days it was completely gone. i havent seen it since it finished its life cycle on the goldfish, and havent had a problem w/ it since. From what you described...it sounds serial enough to clear the fish to another tank (unaffected) and raise the temp, add salt w/e. try not to ovemedicate. mait a few weeks, then add a fish a few at a time. I find ich mostly attacks when i fish is stressed (it has just been through a rough trimp from a petstore, or it wasnt acclimated properly and went into shock, got covered with ich) there are a lot of causes i suspect. maybe a little more research would help. I usually just dont medicate and the ich clears on its own (my past pleco had the same story as my goldfish did. no he didnt die i just gave him away.) I'm just stating that fish can sometimes overcome ich. Maybe some water changes might help? bad water quality might also trigger these parasites as the fishes immune system is weakened with any sort of long-term stress. __________________ Credit goes to Lludu

11-14-2009, 02:39 PM	#8
Newman Super Fish Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Northern NJ Posts: 2,779	I dont know, its a curious question. From the way ive experienced, yes it is APPEARS to be possible. Ich often appears when you place new fish in or when you overstock. the new fish that may display ich upon their first few days in your tank will contaminate your other fish and thats probably how a breakout occurs. also the overstocking question (that i was asking myself): 1. overtocking can obviously happen when you instroduce more new fish. now those could be infected and contaminate your ich-free fish. 2. overstocking can also be a result of new fry overpopulating the tank. so say your stock is all healthy and your fish havent seen ich for say 3 years until they decided to breed. then you got about 30 fry growin up and at a certain point they actually overstock the tank. and BAM you start seeing ich appear where the heck did that come from?! you didnt introduce any fish or plants or anything new, so how did ich just spawn in there on all your fish? I obviously have no answer to the second scenario, so what you've asked is actually an interesting question. maybe someone who has tested this kinda stuff can chime in and explain it :[ ? cant seem to answer the #2 since i havent tested it out yet, so i cant really 100% say that a tank can be ich free. Theoretically if you dont overstock, feed you fish right and the correct amount, if you keep a brackish or marine tank, and your temp is in the fishes' desired range then you shouldt ever see ich appear. unless you obviously add new fish... __________________ Credit goes to Lludu

11-14-2009, 05:55 PM	#9
Nemo'sMom Teenie Weenie Fish Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 36	I found this site that seems to explain Ich in a pretty straightforward manner. I thought about copying the info here, but there's a lot of it. Thought about paraphrasing, but there is still too much information :-) I would recommend reading it to anyone who wants to know more about Ich. They do talk about the life-cycle and when to treat and how to clean a tank that is infected. Should answer most/all of your questions. Cause, Treatment, and Prevention of Ich in Freshwater Fish __________________ 26 gallon: 1 Red Oranda (I have a 2 yo... of course his name is Nemo) 1 Calico Ryukin (Nigel ... again "Finding Nemo") 1 Red/White Ryukin (Coral ... you get the picture) 3 gallon: shrimp someday?

11-14-2009, 06:20 PM	#10
Newman Super Fish Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Northern NJ Posts: 2,779	that is an awsome and very infromative site, thanks! I think it basically is the longer version of my post, especially the last thing i said there. except i would have to change the YES to a NO. and the brackish and marine tank is just a little bit on how salty water improves immunity (in some cases). BUT this source doesnt exactly say how ich can just "randomly" break out in a healthy tank, when youve added no new plants or fish or anything. what the site says is what i said before: that fluctuations in temp, ammonia present, basically anything that causes stress and weakening of the immune system will cause an outbreak of ich. so...where did that ich comefrom if the tank is "ich free"? It seems like the site is saying that a tank can never be ich-free. its just that, it seems that way, when our fish are at their best and their immune systems are too strong for ich to take over and manifest as the visible white dots. So looks like the aquarium cant ever be ich free eh? Soooo if you drastically lowered the temp in a tropical tank or raised the temp in a goldfish tank, then ich would strike like the little parasitic ninja that it is.... __________________ Credit goes to Lludu Last edited by Newman; 11-14-2009 at 06:26 PM..